On-Demand Webinar: The Candidate Experience - What Candidates Really Want

We share our best practices - What makes a good Candidate Experience for us?

Here's what you'll learn in the webinar:

The general definition of candidate experience describes the experiences that applicants have with a company throughout the entire recruiting process. But what constitutes the optimal candidate experience? Steffen Krüger and Sandra Rang address this question in our expert interview.

Watch online now (German only):

The speakers

Sandra Rang has been a part of diva-e since 2014. She joined as a project manager and successively moved into HR. As HR Business Partner, Sandra has set her focus on recruiting.
Sandra Rang
HR Business Partner & Team Lead
Steffen Krüger has been working as a recruiter at diva-e since 2018. He is responsible for in-house recruiting at the Berlin, Jena, Leipzig and Hamburg sites.
Steffen Krüger
Recruiter

Transcript of the Webinar: Candidate Experience - What Candidates Really Want

Introduction and welcome

Angela Meyer: And welcome to our diva-e webinar Candidate Experience - What candidates really want. In this webinar, our HR experts Sandra Rang and Steffen Krüger reveal what an optimal candidate experience looks like. Let's start with a short round of introductions. My name is Angela Meyer, and I have been part of the diva-e-marketing team for four and a half years. Today I'm your moderator and, among other things, I'm in charge of the events and webinars at diva-e. Sandra and Steffen, a few words about you.

Sandra Rang: With pleasure, then I'll start. Hello, my name is Sandra Rang. I have been with diva-e for more than six and a half years now. I can be found at diva-e's Munich office. I am an HR business partner and look after recruiting and personnel marketing. Perhaps it's still quite exciting. How did I get into recruiting? I have been working in this field for more or less ten years. My focus was more on project management of online projects in the past. One day, I was asked to look for working students because we need testers. And that's when I realized that this was fun and that I would like to dive deeper into this area. Over the years, I have taken on more and more tasks in this area. That's right, and for the last three and a half years, I've been wholly focused on HR, primarily recruiting. Exactly, I look forward to our webinar today and handing it over to Steffen.

Steffen Krüger: Yes, thank you Sanny, as I said, my name is Steffen. I'm also in the recruiting and HR team at diva-e. For about two and a half years, two, three years now. I have been doing the job for a total of four years now, four and a half years. Just a rough estimate. And actually, I come from a completely different field. I used to have a social education background. Or I still do. And worked in a language daycare and language school for German and English. And then, I went abroad in 2016. And yes, I then just realized that I would like to do something new. And then I somehow ended up in recruiting via two or three corners. And yes, it was much fun. Had great mentors and a lot of great experiences. Well, and then at some point, the time came that I wanted to go back to Germany. And lo and behold, diva-e came along and offered me a platform. And now I've been here for a few years, and I'm in charge of recruiting for the Berlin, Hamburg, Jena and Leipzig locations, to be exact.

Angela Meyer: Yeah, great. Thank you both for the insights on how you got into recruiting. And now we start with our expert interview and hope the participants enjoy listening. Sandra and Steffen, why don't you start by telling us how recruiting works at diva-e? What does the process look like here?

What does the recruiting process at diva-e look like?

Sandra Rang: I'd love to. I would just get started. We have also brought a small presentation to illustrate the process briefly. Exactly, so with us, of course, it begins pretty classically. We need new employees for whatever area. Then we start in the recruiting team with the classic job advertisement. Be it on career portals, job fairs, at universities or via social media. At the same time, however, we also start the direct approach. This means approaching passive candidates and drawing their attention to our vacancies, in other words, getting them excited about the company. Strictly, the candidates who have found our job advertisements, i.e. who actively apply to us, do so via our career portal or by email. And we in Recruiting take over the initial screening and assessment of the candidates. We aim to forward the candidates we receive to the personnel managers or the specialist contacts within two working days. You know, that's sporting sometimes with two days. Because not all application documents are always complete, but that's simply our goal here, to get speed into the process. In the same way, we would also like to receive feedback from the recruiters within two more working days to give our candidates initial feedback within a week. Of course, in some cases, this also means a rejection. But again, candidates must know where they stand early on. This means it is useless if we delay candidates for a long time when we already know they are not a good match. And it is even less helpful for the candidates if they are held off for weeks or months. But of course, the positive path should also continue within a week. Namely, then the invitation to a first interview. If there are, for example, still technical question marks, that can be first a telephone interview with someone from the specialist area. Or now all interviews, all first and second interviews, are taking place virtually any way because of the current Corona situation. Then just primarily through teams via video conference. Right, next slide. Right, next fall. In our first interview, we always have the team leader, representatives from the department, and someone from the recruiting team attend. Because again, we just want to connect with the candidates. The candidates already know us as recruiters. We are in exchange. We are also a bit of support for the candidates during the interview. The anchor point that they can hold on to. And the first interview aims first to check whether the candidate and the job requirements and we, the candidate and the company, fit together. If the candidates are convincing, the next step is to know the team. It may be that, if there are still technical questions in between, a second interview is scheduled. But usually, the next step for us after the first interview is getting to know the team or the taster day. This takes place no more than five working days after the first interview. Because we want to continue to ensure a fast process for the candidates and us, of course, this team get-to-know-you day aims for the candidates to see what a classic day at work at diva-e looks like. What could be the first tasks that await me? And, of course, to get to know the colleagues. The colleagues should get to know the applicant, and of course, the applicant should get to know us. Simply to see if we fit together as people. That is always a point that is extremely important to us. Exactly, after getting to know each other as a team, we then discuss things together as a team. Whether you want to take the next step with the candidate. And here, the candidate also gets feedback from us within two working days. Before accepting a candidate, we carry out the BEO sanctions check. Here is the background, the EU framework regulation on counter-terrorism. And if this check is negative, which is positive, the candidate gets the contract offer from us. And so you can say that our total duration in the recruiting process requires a maximum of 14 days from receipt of application to contract commitment.

After the signing of the contract

Steffen Krüger: Exactly, but of course, the whole recruiting process, the candidate experience does not end with the signature. Gladly one more slide. Because then, of course, comes the contract situation, the signing of the contract. The candidate decides for us, and we choose for the candidate. And then the pre-onboarding begins. Of course, the employee must receive an induction plan from us, where the first ten to 14 days are pre-structured a little bit, and a guiding takes place so that the start can be designed as optimal as possible for both parties. In addition, of course, the candidate is already invited to team events and company celebrations. Of course, outside of the Corona situation, these are events where the candidate is present. Now, of course, it's more remote. That is, of course, also very important. But even there, a specific connection is created, and the start is optimally designed. Of course, there is also a contact person. This is the HR business partner. And also the specialist, the specialist contact person, which in most cases is the team leader, for example. And you just make sure that you get the start as optimal as possible. And then the candidate, or the new colleague, starts. And then there is a six-month probationary period, which I think is quite normal. And in these six months, there are three probationary period interviews. And these probationary period interviews mustn't be tested interviews or something like that. It's all about positive feedback. How does the new colleague feel? What is going well, what does he still need, what is missing. What is the input to diva-e and us? You just make sure that you can get off to the best possible start; that's it. Yes, but beyond that, the recruiting process is a bit more than just a closed system. For us, the recruiting process in quotation marks is ultimately always a bit of a guide. No more and no less. Because you have to consider that people are individual and every candidate has unique needs, in other words, every process, every candidate journey is always personal. And then, you simply adapt this guideline, this recruiting process, to the candidate. To simply, in each case, bring out the best for the candidate and the hiring manager and the entire company.

Angela Meyer: Very nice, now we know the application and recruiting process at diva-e. And now we would like to get to know the diva-e specialities.

What are the unique features of our candidate experience at diva-e?

Steffen Krüger: Yes, I would like to tackle the question. So I think an essential feature that shines out is the so-called coffee date. The applicant has, so to speak, the possibility or the prospective customer, that is then from the time of the Candidate Journey still no applicant so to speak the options entrance into the enterprise to get. There is a click area on our career portal where the applicant can dial in and select an appointment slot. And they can visit diva-e at the locations we have in Germany. This visit usually takes place with a team leader, where exchange occurs. And finally, it is also essential that this is not yet an actual interview, but rather something like an open day, you could say. Where we simply get to know each other. The applicant or the interested party can, of course, already bring his application documents. These are then also subject to data protection. And the bureaucratic way, so to speak, is then also preserved. The aim is to make it easier for people to get started. This is, of course, a delightful opportunity for young career starters, students, trainees, interns and so on to simply experience the optimal candidate journey at an early stage. Yes, exactly.

Sandra Rang: Yes, and for me, two other special features in our candidate experience are our JOBSaround videos. We have created videos in cooperation with JOBSaround, which are more or less like filmed job ads. They are presented directly by the teams. Requests, customers, possible projects, areas of responsibility are briefly submitted in the video. And candidates can watch the videos on our website and get an idea of what it's like to work at diva-e. Simply learn more, which you wouldn't readout of the job advertisement alone. Exactly, and the second unique thing about us is the different ways you can apply. On the one hand, of course, you can classically submit your documents, either by email or via our application form. But even here, candidates have the option of deciding whether or not they want to include a cover letter. We have also explicitly stated that we do not require this. Of course, this plays into the fact that many people now want a faster process. And everyone who has ever applied knows it. The cover letter is always tricky. You don't know exactly what I'm going to write. Do I hit the right words? And so we can just take that pressure off because we are clearly of the opinion that no cover letter is not a no-go for us. And then the whole thing in combination also with the options to either apply by video. So really, record a 30-second video with your cell phone. Upload the entire thing and introduce yourself briefly. Or if you don't want to record a video of yourself, you can just do that, as you know from WhatsApp, when you send voice messages back and forth, the whole thing just by voice message. Submit those along with the CV and the references. We are looking at an application that's just as complete. And we can even gain a more personal impression of the candidates through videos or audio recordings.

Angela Meyer: Yes, these are excellent activities that we already offer the candidates to get in touch with us.

How does diva-e further develop the candidate experience?

Steffen Krüger: Yes, so overall, I would say that we naturally use a wide variety of formats in the company to develop ourselves constantly. Among other things, we have weekly recruiting meetings in our recruiting team. Of course, this is also a bit of the, yes, current topics. What's happening right now? What updates are there? How does the job plan look like and so on? But of course, everyone also has the opportunity to bring in new ideas every week at this meeting. And these are then evaluated together. Then it is decided what is currently suitable. What do you want to implement immediately? What is also very important is that you also bring in speed. Which, in the end, also helps the entire candidate experience. To stand out from others, of course. In addition, of course, we also have the recruiting meeting, as we call it. This also takes place annually. We sit down with the whole team, evaluate new ideas, and do complete planning for the entire year. And yes, simply look at what fits us at the moment and where the trend is going. And how do we want to develop? Of course, this is then coordinated with the management. And in the end, we just see how it fits together optimally. And of course, it is also essential that we want to participate together. That it doesn't happen in a top-down way, but that it is simply clear that we as recruiters or with the HR business partners are simply the experts in our field and ultimately enjoy the complete trust of making recruiting for diva-e as successful as possible. Which I think is a significant point. But we also have formats that eventually affect all departments of the entire company that we have annually. For example, two years ago, we had the diva-e-portfolio conference. And it was great. It was a great format with many speaker slots, lectures, workshops. And that's where, for example, the idea of the coffee date came about, which I mentioned earlier. And the idea didn't come from the recruiting team but rather from colleagues from other departments, which means that every colleague can participate. Which I think is a critical format to make a company or of course then affected to our area, the recruiting site more successful, exactly.

Angela Meyer: Yes, good. And now it's getting exciting. Namely, Sandra and Steffen, we want to talk business with you. We want to know what the candidates want. What do you think?

What do candidates want?

Steffen Krüger: Exactly, so I think there are always three components from my perspective. The first is trust. I believe that it is vital that there is a relationship of trust between the recruiter and the candidate. I always like to think back to my early days when I was still working with children. As an educator, it was all about accompanying the children, developing social interaction with each other and building social bonds. And that might sound a little bit far-fetched, but I think you can apply that to working with adults ultimately, or big kids, as I always like to call it. That it's about simply having a trusting relationship and also understanding that recruiting is, of course, also sales somewhere. And you just have to take with you that I think if you want to sell something, whether it's a product or a service or ultimately a job, trust is always the be-all and end-all. And that you simply stand up for the candidate in our sense of the word. Beyond that, now the second component for me it's speed. You merely understand in recruiting and the candidate experience that you have to be extremely fast. Why do we have this 14-day process? People ask us, how do you manage that, how do you do that? And yes, in the end, it's simply these short decision-making processes that make this possible. And that people also understand that we have to be quick in recruiting because other recruiters don't sleep either. And then the candidate might be gone or decide on something else. I think these are factors that play a role. You also have to say that that's a critical component, honestly. Yes, the last thing from my point of view, which I always find, is this whole issue of commitment—so speaking that the recruiter has to understand the candidate and generally commit to the candidate as well. And sort of what a caregiver is like. Really from application intake or if you talk about active sourcing, from initial contact, initial approach to signing the contract. It then gets handed off to the HR business partner in the diva-e case. And that's where commitment is simply fundamental. And that you then perhaps also challenge the company internally from time to time if there are discrepancies or something. And also challenge the hiring manager or the team leader. And move with the candidate and merely try to get the best out of it and make it clear that you have always thought of something, ultimately, how it can come to such a so-called match in the end, strictly. So I guess the three components are always crucial in the future.

Sandra Rang: Well, I would also sign all of them in the end. I would add one more thing, and that is I believe that candidates also want an authentic insight into the company, and that is best even before they decide to apply. Sure, when candidates go to a career site, everything looks super great at first. But what is it like? What is it like in the company? So what can I expect there? What is the culture like? What is perhaps tasks that I would not enjoy so much? But simply to know what is in store for me. And we try to satisfy this desire through our various activities, whether it's the coffee date or WhatsApp recruiting or the early involvement of developers in interviews. Even just through active sourcing. So then, for example, you take a developer with you into the conversation. Simply to give real insights that you wouldn't get at first glance from a job ad or a career site, exactly.

Angela Meyer: Well, yes, thank you, Sandra and Steffen. And now we have heard that being authentic is super essential, among other things. Of course, evaluations also play an indispensable role.

Steffen Krüger: Absolutely.

Angela Meyer: Yes, how do you evaluate the candidate experience? Do you use tools for that?

What tools are used for the candidate experience?

Steffen Krüger: Yes, definitely. I think everyone is familiar with these classic application tools that you can use, such as Glassdoor or Kununu. And the thing is that we have decided quite clearly for Kununu, and there is also an actual page that we look after. And that, of course, we take into account the complete feedback. And I think that in terms of the candidate experience or to improve the candidate experience, it's not about getting a five-star rating as quickly as possible on applicant portals. But that it is also about dealing with inadequate evaluations. And then include them in how you can improve your own candidate experience. And in the end, the applicant also can participate. And by really, yes, simply using what is written there to improve ourselves in the long term. And that's why I believe that these portals are significant. Of course, there will be other possibilities in the future. But at the moment, you can see that in Germany, especially Kununu and Glassdoor have priority, and it's really about taking this feedback and using it for the whole further development. And simply also dealing with inadequate evaluations from time to time. Because it is also part of it, there is also sometimes a bad evaluation. And it is also quite normal. People also make mistakes. And yes, to simply continue to grow and continue to develop from my point of view.

Angela Meyer: Yes, that does sound good. And now we come from the ratings to the topic AI and AI. That's also on everyone's lips. And any tools use data. What do you think? Does AI bring a better candidate experience? Yes or no?

Sandra Rang: My answer would be a resounding yes. So for the applicant pre-selection, it is undoubtedly positive to become faster and more efficient. But from my point of view, the personal touch must not be lost. We have already come a long way in recruiting with AI and AI. So there are even bots with which you can first conduct telephone interviews, and you probably wouldn't even notice that you're talking to a bot. So that's where we're at. But for me, that's not the way I would personally want to go in recruiting. It certainly makes sense if you're going to build pipelines or have specific profiles based on unambiguous criteria. For example, a particular programming language must be present in the CV or a specific tool. Or it must be, in any case, a German-speaking profile, for example. It certainly makes sense to be able to select more quickly. In my opinion, however, personal support, which Steffen also mentioned earlier, must begin relatively early in the process. A relationship with the candidates must be built up to inspire and win them over for the company and the position. So I find that immensely important.

Steffen Krüger: Yes, I would agree, so I think that the whole topic of AI, what you just said Sani with chatbots and so on, that is not yet so far developed. And I also ask myself quite honestly. I always ask myself whether it will ever be so far or when it will happen. And currently, you can answer the question so that AI can be an excellent support to automate certain things, I think. But conversely, to ensure that the recruiter can spend even more time with the candidate through automation and can put even more into the trusting work. Even more in this personal relationship, as we have already mentioned once or twice, to ensure this optimal candidate journey. And of course, you also have to say, from my point of view, I don't see yet that AI or chatbots feel certain things like empathy or have any feelings at all. And I think these are simply critical points for social connections that are always part of it. So not only in recruiting but in all areas of life, in all areas of work, areas of life where you have to deal with people. And that's why I think we're still not at the point where AI will replace the recruiter per se and just support them. And in the sense that we can make the candidate experience a bit better with the time and investment factor.

Angela Meyer: Okay, then AI is also, so to speak, another challenge for the future in recruiting. And now I would like to talk to you about challenges. What is the most challenging thing for you in recruiting Sandra and Steffen?

What are the challenges in recruiting?

Steffen Krieger: Yes, I would like to answer that. Now we have talked a lot about the personal touch. And I think that also closes the circle a bit, with that. For me, it's always the rejections. So I'll be honest and say that I find cancellations super tricky. Because, as I said, you already have such a bond, and you're also happy for the candidates. And you're also excited that maybe you'll be hired. And then, for whatever reason, it doesn't work out. And that is always a challenging thing. And for me, it's the rejection, that in the end, it's just kind of sad to see that it doesn't come to cooperation. And yes, I think that is also an obvious answer for me. And I think if it wasn't like that, then, or if these rejections had a certain automatism for me at the end, that you just click on sacrifice, and the thing is done. I think then I would also know a little bit that maybe I'm not doing the job with 100 percent as I'm doing it right now. And that's why it's the cancellation for me. And I think it's also good that it's difficult for me, exactly.

Sandra Rang: Yes, there too. As you can see, Steffen and I tick very similarly on that point. So I can only agree with that. I think rejection is simply the most challenging thing because our process is personal. Because you exchange so much with the individual candidates, you're so close to them. You're there in the interviews. You're there in the discussions. You always want to help them so that they can place themselves in the right way to start with us. You root for them. And if you can't get together, well, it's always like that for me. I'm a bit sad.

Steffen Krieger: But that's just part of it in the end.

Sandra Rang: Exactly, it's part of it, but I'm also with Steffen on that. If at some point you don't mind it anymore, then you know that you shouldn't work as a recruiter anymore.

Steffen Krieger: Maybe.

Angela Meyer: I think that's understandable for all of us, that cancellations are the saddest part of the job. Yes, then I'll move on from the sad part, from the difficulties to something positive now. Namely, we want to know how long your fastest recruiting process took from both of you. Tell us about your insides.

Sandra Rang: With pleasure, well. Yes, we said it initially, so our standard process is always around 14 days. My fastest was actually in Hamburg, we were at a conference and met a candidate there in the evening. The next day he came by for the first interview, the day after that for the second interview, in other words, getting to know the team. Funnily enough, we held this in Hamburg at the Hofbräuhaus. And then we gave him the contract directly on that day, and he signed it. So three working days. Exactly, it was great.

Steffen Krieger: I'll top it again. So we've had, we've had so-called same-day offers, at the same time. That was also a pretty funny thing. That's also a candidate process. I won't forget that so quickly. That was a nice story. We went to an evening event in Leipzig at a partner company and got to know an exciting candidate. And right in the evening, it was somehow apparent that it would work well over a beer. And then, he came to the interview the following day and took the contract with him in the afternoon. And then he signed it right away. So, of course, it goes super fast. But I think the message is simply that you really shouldn't stop yourself. So if you just believe that, it just matches overall. Both socially and, of course, also professionally. You don't have these typical obstacles and have to go back to your superiors and ask all the questions. Instead, there is a fundamental trust that everyone wants the best for the company in the end. And that they will make the right decisions. And I think the two stories are simply great proof that it works even faster than the 14 days. Although I think they are pretty quick overall.

Angela Meyer: So within 14 days or the one day to sign the contract, those are great things that diva-e holds ready, yes. And performs.

Steffen Krieger: We work on it every day.

Angela Meyer: So, and finally, before we start with the Q&A session, one last question for you.

From your point of view, what annoys the candidate the most?

Steffen Krieger: May I?

Sandra Rang: Yes.

Steffen Krieger: Okay, so I think for me, what sucks candidates the most is ghosting, I think. So you hear that again and again, that somehow candidates are hosted by some recruiters. When I'm somehow here in Berlin at events or online events and people, exchange information with each other and ghosting is always a topic. And I always find that a bit of a shame. Because, as we said earlier, adverse decisions or cancellations also play a role. And it shouldn't be about ghosting candidates because that's a part that always hangs like a sword of Damocles over the whole recruiting process. And in the end, it creates a bad reputation in the industry. And I'm always a bit sorry about that because I think that there are many recruiters who do an excellent job, who are incredibly passionate about their job. And, of course, it's always tricky when there are individual cases that ruin the industry. And ultimately, as we said earlier, it's also about working with bad news and making the company better.

Sandra Rang: Yes, I would add what we had already said earlier, so precisely the opposite of our fast process are these long waiting times. When candidates are sometimes told that it sometimes takes months until companies get back to them. What we also know is that candidates are annoyed by this. On the one hand, these are the waiting times and the lack of feedback on the current status. We are always in close contact with candidates. We confirm receipt of the application. We let them know if it takes longer. We will get in touch when the application has been forwarded. Of course, we send out invitations to the interviews. So we are in constant exchange. And that is also extremely important to many people, simply to know the current status because, unfortunately, it is not yet standard practice to receive information about the current status of an application.

Steffen Krieger: which is why perhaps to add to that a bit, I think it should be the case that speed is critical. But rate doesn't just mean herding the candidate or applicant as quickly as possible. But also to transmit bad news quickly. Because, as I said, in the end, it has a lasting effect on the candidate experience if you don't give people bad news. For example, you should play with the idea that you always see each other twice in life and that there is also a network. And it is simply essential always to have an extremely professional, trusting, personal relationship with each other at all levels.

Sandra Rang: Maybe that's also a perfect point that Steffen just said to deliver the bad news quickly. We always get much positive feedback, even though we reject the candidates. For example, if we receive an application after the process has not progressed that far, we still get positive feedback on the exchange, communication, or speed. However, we have delivered something negative, which is always very friendly.

Steffen Krieger: That's right.

Q&A

Angela Meyer: That's great if you are just so quick, that can only give positive feedback. Great, yes, now we are through with our expert interview. With our questions. And now it's your turn. You have the time and the chance to ask your questions to Sandra and Steffen. The two of them are eager to hear what you want to know from them. And I'll have a look here, which questions have come in the meantime. One moment. Someone here would like to know:

How much do you search for potential candidates on the web as a recruiter? So Facebook, Insta. How much influence does that have on your decision?

Sandra Rang: Now I have to ask again. I didn't quite catch it acoustically.

Steffen Krieger: I didn't completely understand the question either.

Angela Meyer: So you research the candidates in social media? Does that influence you?

Steffen Krieger: Yes.

Sandra Rang: I see. Well, of course, we search for candidates on LinkedIn, Xing or GitHub, for example, to find them. But we didn't research person XY a week ago at a festival or a party and let it rip there. So we don't do that. That's private life. Everyone can do what they want. So we research the professional networks for candidates.

Steffen Krieger: Yes, I would completely agree with that.

Angela Meyer: Okay good, then I hope that clears up the question. So, we're going to move on. And that is, does anyone here want to know:

What are you actively doing to promote diversity in the company?

Sandra Rang: Do you want to answer, or should I answer Steffen?

Steffen Krieger: Yes, well, I'm happy to start. Internally, of course, we have a wide variety of project groups at diva-e. Of course, we also introduce them in the job interviews. For example, even the Diversity Team, where Sani and I are both parts of the project group. They deal with precisely these kinds of questions. So how do we create more cultural diversity in the company? But of course, it's not just about achieving a quota of women or something like that. But there are also important issues such as before the applicants come or where our employees come from. And in which federal states do they work. So there are also fun facts that you can simply bring in, which we also use. Yes, and we are part of that. And I think it's nice, especially in the sense of diva-e, that with our project groups, we have colleagues who don't have so much to do with each other in the classic business, in the traditional daily business. And there, you can also simply network. But there are also other project groups that we have in the company, where people exchange information. Yes, but as I said, we also have many different formats. Workshops, conferences, meet-ups. So we use many opportunities for our colleagues to network with each other. I hope that answers the question a little bit.

Sandra Rang: Maybe supplementary, if the question was about something like anonymizing the CV's before we get them for evaluation or something. That's the direction it was going. We don't have that at the moment. But it will be one of the topics we deal with in the future. And what we would like into the applicant management system, for example.

Steffen Krieger: Yes.

Angela Meyer: Yes, diversity is an exciting topic that interests our participants here. And indeed, someone here would like to know more:

Offers on the topic of promoting women in leadership positions. How do we encourage this? Topic Female Shift. And can we use our offers to address more women in recruiting specifically?

Sandra Rang: Well, maybe I'll answer the question from my point of view. As a woman and also as a recruiter. For us, it's pretty clear that the technical skills are in the foreground. Of course, we are, diva-e is an IT company. We are a male-dominated industry. But we have, and that's why we also have this with the anonymous CVs. It doesn't just go one way. It goes both ways. The professional focus is in the foreground. And in the first place, it doesn't matter which gender the person is. No matter which gender. Yes, and in the company, of course, apart from the recruiting process, we have, for example, management development programs. There are various possibilities. But I think someone else would be better to say whether we have a quota for women. In general, the focus is more on professional skills in our company, and that gender is secondary.

Steffen Krieger: Absolutely.

Angela Meyer: Well, I hope this also clarifies the question. And I'll take up the next question here. And someone would like to know:

What is a no-go in the candidate experience? Do we have any?

Steffen Krieger: Yes, definitely. I had already touched on it a bit earlier. So, in any case, ghosting is an absolute no-go for me in the candidate experience. But I think overall. The time factor is simply also the decisive factor. That you don't keep candidates waiting and somehow play for time or something else, that's the that's an essential thing for me. That there is simply trustful cooperation on all levels. That the candidates are dealt with professionally. And I was simply trusting that they would do the right thing. So as I said, the time factor is the most important thing for me. Speed is of the essence. And playing for time, delaying things, giving false feedback or not giving authentic and honest feedback is an absolute no-go in the candidate experience, which always has a lasting effect, which can then also have a negative impact. And could put the entire company in a light that I don't think anyone wants.

Angela Meyer: No, definitely not. And now I would like to ask you one more question. And someone would like to know:

What makes a good recruiter from your point of view?

Sandra Rang: I would answer that maybe. So I would say you have to have a good sense of people and vibe, so empathy. To be open. Also really have a desire to approach people. Of course, you move a bit out of your comfort zone every time you actively come to people at trade fairs and conferences, for example, who might not feel like talking to you at first. So just be open, approach people, and I think you just have to bring an enthusiasm for recruiting itself. If you don't do that, I don't believe you will be happy in the field in the long run. Yeah, those would be the points that you need.

Steffen Krieger: Ditto.

Angela Meyer: Yes, I just agree with that. And someone here wants to know:

What do you think is the most exciting thing about recruiting?

Steffen Krieger: Wow, good question. I think for me it's two points. One is networking per se. So really moving around in these virtual spaces. Connecting with people, exchanging ideas. Of course, there are always these initial conversations where you get to know each other and simply start to build up this relationship with the other person. I think these are essential points that I enjoy. And what I also find exciting is a bit of that sales gene that recruiting also has, is simply this offer phase. Delivering the offer to the candidate and simply feeling how happy the candidate is or how happy they are about it. And then this extreme arises. These are points. I don't know, every time my heart starts beating again. These are, for me simply, the most exciting topics is just really then this offer phase. That's much fun. I think that is. I think I speak for every recruiter.

Sandra Rang: Yes. So I would also sign like that. And for me, in any case, the very first place is simply this, this contact new people. So you always get to know new people, new personalities that you have to adjust to. Every person is different. You think you have experienced everything. And then something comes up again that you simply haven't experienced yet, so it, yes.

Steffen Krieger: Absolutely.

Angela Meyer: Yes, I also think that simply this contact with new people, networking, is certainly much fun.

Steffen Krieger: Actually, it's also.

Sandra Rang: You are also welcome to do an internship with us somehow.

Angela Meyer: I have always done a bit of personnel marketing.

Steffen Krieger: Maybe you can add that what I also find exciting is the general development of new recruiting methods. Or simply this search for new tools and technologies that also exist on the recruiting market. Not only in the IT industry in general. But specific to recruiting. There are so many ways to recruit candidates. There are many meet-ups and conferences where you can network and exchange ideas as a recruiter. And always learn something new. And I just find that super exciting, and I think it makes it a very diverse profession.

Angela Meyer: Yes, great, in any case, fascinating insights you have given us into the application process for diva-e and your experiences. I would like to end the question and answer session with that. But of course, you are welcome to contact Sandra and Steffen afterwards. You can write them an email or connect directly with them on LinkedIn. In any case, they will be happy if you stay in touch.

Sandra Rang: Very much so.

Steffen Krieger: I'd love to, by all means. I'm also on Xing for those who don't have LinkedIn yet.

Angela Meyer: And yes, if you would like to listen to the webinar afterwards in quiet, that's no problem. Because starting tomorrow, we will also make the recording available on our website. And here's a note about our other webinars. It remains exciting. Because in February, Deutsche Post will be our guest. And we'll be talking about how you can increase your customers' propensity to buy with automated and personalized direct mail. So it's an exciting topic, and you're welcome to drop by our diva-e website slash webinars. We look forward to your participation. Yes, and then thank you both for your time, for your insights on the subject of the Candidate Experience.

Steffen Krieger: With pleasure.

Sandra Rang: Very much so.

Angela Meyer: In any case, it was much fun to chat with you, and I wish you a nice day.

Steffen Krieger: Super thanks.

Angela Meyer: Ciao.

Sandra Rang: Thank you, likewise. Ciao.